Resurrection Evidence: Christian Apologetics

SPEAKER A 00:00:00 - 00:00:36 Of all the ways God has revealed himself throughout history, the Bible points to one moment as his final, ultimate statement. Not a text, not a law, but a person. And the resurrection of that person, a public event witnessed by thousands, was so unexpected and so undeniable that it changed the world. In this episode, we examine why Jesus is the most extraordinary piece of evidence in human history. Welcome to Faith and Science. I'm Kaysie Vokurka, and joining me to discuss this topic is Dr. John Ashton. Welcome once again to the program, Dr. John. SPEAKER B 00:00:36 - 00:00:37 Hello, Kaysie. SPEAKER A 00:00:37 - 00:01:11 Dr. John has written this book called The Big Argument: Does God Exist? And in today's program, we are looking at chapter 13, Who Is God and What Is He Like? by Dr. Stephen Thompson. Now, this chapter says that the amazing events in the life of Jesus, especially his resurrection, convinced many of his contemporaries That through Jesus, God began to relate to people in a new and unique way. So what is it about the resurrection specifically that makes it such a pivotal piece of evidence? SPEAKER B 00:01:11 - 00:01:20 So the resurrection, of course, relates to the fact that just beforehand, Jesus was very cruelly killed on the cross. SPEAKER A 00:01:20 - 00:01:21 True. SPEAKER B 00:01:21 - 00:01:53 So it's, you know, quite a horrific form of execution. There are lots of, well, not lots fortunately, but a number of other forms that people have devised, different ways of killing people that have prolonged the pain for as long as possible. And we don't wanna discuss and think about these, but the crucifixion was a particularly painful and dramatic way to make sure somebody died. SPEAKER A 00:01:53 - 00:01:53 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:01:54 - 00:02:11 And Jesus went through that. So it involved quite a lot of suffering, quite a lot of suffering before the crucifixion in terms of the whipping that occurred, the removal of flesh by the whipping, scourging it was called. SPEAKER A 00:02:11 - 00:02:12 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:02:12 - 00:02:28 And then the physically carrying the cross to the time, the nailing of nails through the feet and the hands to suspend the body on the cross. So a lot of pain was inflicted at that time. SPEAKER A 00:02:28 - 00:02:29 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:02:29 - 00:03:23 And then the difficulty in breathing, the pain to maintain breathing and so forth. But we also know from the description that Jesus was confirmed to be dead by the Romans. They made sure by thrusting a spear in through His left side. They knew where the heart was. They knew how to stop the heart if it was still beating. And we know from the description that it seemed congealed blood and so forth flowed out at that particular time. So Jesus was definitely dead. But then we have the eyewitness event of Jesus' resurrection and the descriptions that are recorded there. And this is actually quite important, these descriptions and accounts, because people at that time knew that dead people didn't come back to life again, right? SPEAKER A 00:03:23 - 00:03:23 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:03:23 - 00:03:50 They were aware that when When people are dead, they die, they stay dead. And so when the disciples went to see Jesus, went to finish the burial of Jesus, so I think it's important for people to understand there are 2 aspects of this. There's the details of the burial and there is the details of the records of the burial. SPEAKER A 00:03:50 - 00:03:50 Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. SPEAKER B 00:03:50 - 00:04:16 And so maybe let's deal with the latter first. Secondly, we have the accounts of the different authors, John and Luke, for example. We know Luke was a physician and he writes quite meticulously. And he says that the purpose of his writing of his books, both the Book of Luke and the Book of Acts, were to make— were to compile accurate records of events that occurred. SPEAKER A 00:04:16 - 00:04:16 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:04:16 - 00:05:04 And we also know from checking his writings, the things that we can check today, they're all very accurate. They're all spot on. In fact, some of the details of some of the rulers who were ruling in particular city at the time, that for a long time historians doubted and thought that Luke had got it wrong. Since that time, archaeological discoveries have been found that confirmed that again Luke was spot on in every case of naming particular people in certain places at certain times. Similarly, with the Book of John, he provides a lot of detail, a lot of detail that Again, he's writing to confirm he was an eyewitness, and he's writing it to confirm what his account was. SPEAKER A 00:05:04 - 00:05:05 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:05:05 - 00:05:33 Now, the other thing is that we have a large number of those original transcripts have been preserved for us. So I think, and so other authors writing at that time have quoted from these different transcripts to the point that, There's something like 30,000 transcripts have been found in different other writings, on inscriptions, in old buildings and this sort of thing. SPEAKER A 00:05:33 - 00:05:39 This is of the original account that Luke wrote and that John wrote. There's multiple copies of transcripts of those writings. SPEAKER B 00:05:39 - 00:06:02 Is that what you mean? Well, not the whole writings, but parts of them, quotes of them, to the point that we could actually construct virtually the whole New Testament account of Jesus, except for about a dozen verses, just from these other quotes that have been recorded elsewhere. There's over 30,000. have been discovered inscribed on things in different other letters and ancient documents, right? SPEAKER A 00:06:02 - 00:06:02 Mm-hmm. SPEAKER B 00:06:02 - 00:06:11 But we also have full copies of these books that go back to the 1st and 2nd centuries AD. SPEAKER A 00:06:11 - 00:06:11 Mm. SPEAKER B 00:06:11 - 00:06:32 All right, so, and we have quite a large number, hundreds of copies of these have been preserved. Now when we look at, say, Tacitus' History of Rome, We've only got a few copies and they date back to probably about 700 or 800 AD. We don't have any— they're copies that were made hundreds of years later. SPEAKER A 00:06:32 - 00:06:33 Wow. SPEAKER B 00:06:33 - 00:06:33 Right? SPEAKER A 00:06:33 - 00:06:33 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:06:33 - 00:07:06 And we've got 1 or 2 copies that go back to that particular time. The same with a lot of these ancient writings that we have no problems accepting as history of Rome, you know, history of the different times, the writing of Homer, of Herodotus, and so forth, other historians. When we come to the scriptures, we have more original texts and documents and archaeological evidence attesting to those records of any other documentation of ancient history. SPEAKER A 00:07:06 - 00:07:07 Wow. Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:07:08 - 00:07:32 So it is overwhelmingly corroborated with written eyewitness account evidence that were preserved. And these were preserved because they were eyewitness accounts. And these eyewitness accounts That changed their lives. The fact that they faced death to tell that truth, that that miracle actually happened of the resurrection and the translation of Jesus. SPEAKER A 00:07:32 - 00:07:33 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:07:33 - 00:08:08 Now, when we go to some of the fine details, because there's a lot of things, okay, we know historically, and I don't think there's anybody today that doubts that Jesus was a historic person who was historically crucified. We have independent secular records of those in the different writings that have survived. The thing was, he was definitely killed. What happened to his body afterwards? So it's very easy to disprove it by having witnesses that say, yep, we saw the body. We can tell you where the body is. Right. SPEAKER A 00:08:09 - 00:08:09 Yes. SPEAKER B 00:08:09 - 00:08:22 And so that would have been very— but no one was able to do that. And that was in the best interest of the politics at the time to say, yeah, he just died. Somebody stole his body. SPEAKER A 00:08:22 - 00:08:23 Mm-hmm. SPEAKER B 00:08:23 - 00:08:39 But one of the interesting things is when we look at the account of John is when— so we know that Mary first went to the tomb, saw that the body was gone, and she raced back. SPEAKER A 00:08:39 - 00:08:40 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:08:40 - 00:09:09 Some of the women raced back and they told Peter. Peter and John then raced down and John went and looked and then Peter raced in and John and Peter were both astonished from what they saw. And what they saw was this. They saw that— well, let's go back to how the body would have been prepared. So what happened was when the, when Jesus' body was taken down from the cross, it would have been wrapped. The tradition was to wrap it in a shroud. SPEAKER A 00:09:09 - 00:09:10 Mm-hmm. SPEAKER B 00:09:10 - 00:09:14 And that shroud was soaked with a mixture of aloes and myrrh. SPEAKER A 00:09:15 - 00:09:15 Okay. SPEAKER B 00:09:15 - 00:09:42 Right, so these were 2 particular herbs. Now, one was sort of a— it's not aloes as in aloe vera, it's a different plant. I forget its botanical name. But essentially, this was a— this provided a sealant. So they weren't mummified, the bodies weren't mummified. But what happened was they put a sort of a sealant over them, and the mixture of this sort of set In a day or so. SPEAKER A 00:09:42 - 00:09:42 I see. SPEAKER B 00:09:42 - 00:10:35 And it formed sort of like a bit of a case because one of the problems was it was a hot area. The body began to smell quite quickly afterwards. And so what happened is they wrapped it in this cloth, which was called a shroud, and the face cloth was put over the— the head was separate and it was tied to the head. Okay. Through the mouth. So it was tied over the mouth. And so this face cloth And that was separate so it could be removed. So they essentially closed the eyes, washed the face, and then coated the body with the mixture in this cloth and it was wrapped up. And then they would finish the preparation the next day. But that was done to start with. Now, what John and Peter saw was they saw that the face cloth was removed and wrapped up neatly, right? SPEAKER A 00:10:35 - 00:10:35 Mm-hmm. SPEAKER B 00:10:35 - 00:10:45 Where the head was. The shape of the shroud, because this had stiffened now, was still in the shape of a body, but there was no body inside. SPEAKER A 00:10:45 - 00:10:48 Oh, wow. So, it's almost like— SPEAKER B 00:10:48 - 00:10:52 So, it's supernatural. Yeah. The mold is still there. SPEAKER A 00:10:52 - 00:10:53 Yeah. SPEAKER B 00:10:53 - 00:10:54 But the body's gone. SPEAKER A 00:10:54 - 00:10:56 Wow. SPEAKER B 00:10:56 - 00:10:58 From, from inside. SPEAKER A 00:10:58 - 00:10:59 That would be— Right. SPEAKER B 00:11:00 - 00:11:05 And that's why the Bible says when they saw, they believed. SPEAKER A 00:11:05 - 00:11:06 Wow. SPEAKER B 00:11:06 - 00:11:09 And they weren't expecting that. They weren't expecting a resurrection. SPEAKER A 00:11:09 - 00:11:10 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:11:10 - 00:11:24 They, they were expecting to go and see the body. They were expecting the bodies there. But, and, and people don't steal bodies, you know, sort of, and leave bits wrapped up neatly and then put the whole thing, you know, back together. SPEAKER A 00:11:24 - 00:11:26 Yeah, they'd probably take all of the parts over. SPEAKER B 00:11:26 - 00:11:27 Well, they'd take the whole lot. SPEAKER A 00:11:27 - 00:11:30 They wouldn't have that there. That's right. SPEAKER B 00:11:30 - 00:11:55 So just some of the fine details that are recorded here, again, all add up. It's all corroborating, corroborating evidence that these accounts are true, that that was a true miraculous event. And so what this event shows is that God allowed Himself to come and relate and participate in the suffering that humans suffer. SPEAKER A 00:11:55 - 00:11:56 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:11:56 - 00:12:20 So just the way treated was Jesus during His life, who was born in poverty. There was— His life was threatened as a baby. All sorts of things. He was obviously treated as a misfit in his community. He worked as a laborer. All these things. He experienced so many things that enabled God to relate to our everyday life experiences. SPEAKER A 00:12:20 - 00:12:20 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:12:20 - 00:12:45 And that's one of the things that the picture— and Dr. Thompson explains it very well— is that this is part of God's eminence, how in a miraculous way, even though He was transcendent and outside creation, For a moment, He became part of creation and experienced that creation so He could show His love to us. SPEAKER A 00:12:45 - 00:12:47 And build a connection with us. SPEAKER B 00:12:47 - 00:13:17 And build that connection. And then also say to those of us who, and all of us have, we've all done bad things. We've all been selfish and so forth to say, I can forgive you because I'm taking your place. I am taking your place in the justice system. The justice that should have been applied to you, I've applied to myself by dying in your place. I've taken the place of justice for you. SPEAKER A 00:13:17 - 00:13:19 Hmm. SPEAKER B 00:13:19 - 00:13:37 And it's a beautiful picture. And that's the essence and the wonderful picture of the Christian faith, which is very different from all the other, all the other faiths. But it fits. It's based on evidence. And that's one of the reasons that I'm so passionate about the Bible and our Christian faith. SPEAKER A 00:13:38 - 00:14:40 Yeah, thank you for taking us through all of that evidence, especially for the resurrection and the lead-up to it with Jesus' crucifixion, because that is something which I think a lot of people have questions about. You know, can we trust that that actually happened? And so the things that you've mentioned are things that we can— would be the standard processes for evaluating, is that historical story something that we can rely on, or is it just a myth? And so, yeah, the fact that that is the case, and then when you've described about the implications of that for us, and for what that means about God, you know, he is someone all-powerful, but he has come so close to us, and in order to build a connection with us that, if you understand the Genesis account, was broken early on in the creation story. So, It's very, very interesting to see how God has done that, because it's unlike, as you said, unlike any other god figure that we are accustomed to in this world. SPEAKER B 00:14:40 - 00:14:41 Exactly, yeah. SPEAKER A 00:14:41 - 00:15:05 That someone would do that. And even in a personal sense, like, who of us would condescend so much to do something that would be equivalent in our sphere of influence, you know? It's pretty profound to have the Creator of everything Coming and just being a part of His creation blows the mind, really, doesn't it? SPEAKER B 00:15:05 - 00:15:05 Yeah. SPEAKER A 00:15:05 - 00:15:07 Yeah. So— SPEAKER B 00:15:07 - 00:15:08 Beautiful story. SPEAKER A 00:15:08 - 00:15:29 Absolutely. Yeah. So thank you for sharing with us those things and look forward to discussing in more detail some of that story in some future episodes. Have you ever struggled with doubts about God's existence or known someone who has? What helped you through it? Share your thoughts and stories in the comments because we'd love to hear about your journey.